I was watching The West Wing last night (don't ask why) and I thought of this post. Martin Sheen's character had a moment of prayer when a wounded solder he was visiting requested it. I thought it was really coincidental giving the results of the recent election. I don't watch the show on a regular basis but I never got a religous vibe from it until last night.

We had this program on TV also (I've never watched it before...it just happened to be on at the in-laws), and I saw the scene to which you refer. My wife and I winked at each other when the only prayer the prez could come up with was the Lord's Prayer. Nothing wrong with that -- it's pretty politically correct as prayers go, I guess -- but hardly a first choice for someone interceding on behalf of a wounded soldier.

Eric, I guess it depends upon what you ask for when "interceding on behalf of a wounded soldier ..."

Seems to me that, "Thy kingdon come; Thy will be done" and "forgive us our trespasses; as we forgive those who trespass against us" would cover most situations very well.

From time to time, when I've had a chance to sit and listen to old soldiers tell war stories, a story of prayer on the battlefield usually comes up.

And so does the Lord's Prayer, over and over again.

When I think about that, I realize that in battlefield conditions, a chance to compose and recite an appropriate prayer - at the time it's called for - doesn't always come up.

That's when the patient teaching of our ministers and Sunday School teachers helps deliver us. Eventually, there comes a point when we all have a prayer or a statement of faith close to heart and mind.

Many of us may stumble when called upon to deliver an original prayer of our own, but we can recite a Lord's Prayer, an Affirmation of Faith, a Rosary or a Psalm (especially the 23rd).

Jeff, there's a story about a general (Patton?) who was wandering around the front in the middle of the night and happened upon a soldier on guard duty. The private was motionless, head bowed, and took no notice of the general's presence until he was right upon him.

"Soldier, were you sleeping on guard duty?!"

"N-no, sir! I was praying, sir!"

"Praying, huh? Well, prove it."

"P-prove it, sir? I, uh..."

"Show me how you pray, soldier!"

With that, the soldier immediately launched into a heartfelt, eloquent prayer that expressed to God his fondest hopes and deepest fears, interceding for his fellow soldiers, his commanding officers, his nation and, of course, his family. He prayed with the simple sincerity and familiarity one has when conversing with a close friend or dear relative.

After he had ended his prayer, the general stood silent for a moment, then thanked the young soldier for his prayer. "I'm sorry I doubted you, private, but I can always tell the difference between those who know how to say a prayer and those who know how to pray. I can tell that you've spent plenty of time in prayer. Carry on."

I bring up that story only to make the point that I think the writers of this TV episode couldn't make the distinction between saying a prayer and praying, or if they did, they either (1) weren't allowed to make it via the character or (2) didn't trust their audience enough to make it.

This was not a hastily tossed-off prayer in the middle of battle, nor was it one of those agonizing intensely personal moments when words don't come and we just have to rely on the Holy Spirit to intercede on our behalf.

I've visited and prayed for lots of people in the hospital, and been around many others who were likewise praying, and I have yet to hear any of them say the Lord's Prayer by rote on such an occasion. All I'm saying is that this particular scene did not ring true with this particular "evangelical Christian" (or his wife). Perhaps it resonated with others with different experiences or perspectives, but if this is how Hollywood is going to show that they, too, have values, then I suggest that they're wasting their time as far as many of us are concerned.

Eric, wonderful story about the general and the private. Thank you for sharing it!

While watching and listening to the prayer in the "West Wing" episode, perhaps it was the setting rather than the choice of words that rang hollow.

Knowing what viewers in the Tall City might feel about the liberal leanings of actors like Matin Sheen, and the liberal thoughts expressed on programs like "West Wing" - openly and subliminally - I wouldn't be surprised if such a moment might be perceived as shallow.

I can't help but think back to a scene near the end of the movie, "Master & Commander" that included what I thought was a very moving recitation of the Lord's Prayer.

Of course, maybe you and the wife shared that same wink when you watched that particular scene on "M&C" ... I do recall that you liked the movie in general.

But if you didn't - if you thought that scene was genuinely moving and sincere in a way that "WW" could never match - then what was the difference?

Maybe it was the production, the setting, the speakers, rather than the choice of words.

Jeff, I'm trying to remember the scene you refer to in M&C. I can't quite recall it, but didn't it involve either a memorial to those lost in battle, or some kind of at-sea burial (or perhaps a gathering in anticipation of battle)? In any event, my recollection is that it was a relatively formal group gathering, with a ceremonial feel to it. In that setting (and in the rather more formal culture of the era), the Lord's Prayer is perfectly acceptable and even expected. It seemed quite in character and I didn't give it a second thought.

So, yes, the difference was the context of each scene.

But, you know, I would never criticize another person's prayer in real life, and that's not my intent here. I simply felt that the WW writers did a poor job of creating something that they apparently felt would ring true. For me, it didn't, and in fact, had the opposite effect of making it even more unlikely than before that I would watch the show in the future.

This discussion touches on some really interesting points, though, and I'm thinking about devoting a separate post to some of them.

Eric, yes, that was the scene, near the end of the film as the crew gathered for burial of those lost in the climactic engagement with the French warship.

Rusell Crowe led the crew in prayer, with cutaways to individual crewmen grieving, and - through it all - Samuel Barber's "Adagio for Strings" playing underneath the spoken words, and the sobs.

"This discussion touches on some really interesting points, though, and I'm thinking about devoting a separate post to some of them." ... I'll look forward to that, Eric!